DOGE Commission and Trump tariff talk

Next up, Grant, a financial journalist and historian, pointed to the redundancy in Trump’s appointments for the Department of Government Efficiency, also referred to as the DOGE Commission.

“If you want to bury an idea in Washington, form a commission,” Grant quipped. “The DOGE Commission, the directive on government efficiency, ladies and gentlemen, has two CEOs.”

He added, “To bring down government spending and to reduce the growth in public debt, President-elect Trump would not have said he would never touch entitlements — but he said that.’

Ultimately Grant believes “the rhetoric is stronger than the intention.”

The panelists also explored potential friction between Trump and the Federal Reserve, speculating on whether Trump will clash with or attempt to dismiss Chair Jerome Powell.

“Let’s talk about the president-elect, Donald Trump, and who is perceived to be the second most powerful person in Washington — that is the Federal Reserve chairman,” said Bianco, president and macro strategist at Bianco Research.

“Trump is not going to reappoint Powell, but Powell knew that he wasn’t going to get reappointed; even if Harris won, she was probably going to appoint (Lael) Brainard to replace him in May of ’26,’ he went on to note.

While Trump is unlikely to reappoint Powell at the end of his term as Fed chair, Bianco does believe Trump is going to make it challenging for Powell to operate.

‘Trump is not, I don’t think, going to fire Powell. I don’t think he wants to have the spectacle,” he said. “He’ll just threaten to fire him every week, and blame everything, including male pattern baldness, on Powell.”

After the laughter from the audience dissipated, Bianco warned that Trump has previously said he would like to be both POTUS and Fed chair — something that has never been done in the country’s history.

Trump’s relationship with the Fed is likely to start on bumpy terms as Powell works to reduce inflation.

“The Fed might be done cutting rates, and Trump wouldn’t be wrong to say, ‘Boy, did that look very political. You were cutting rates before the election like crazy, 50 basis points. Then I (get elected) and you stop?’ That could wind up becoming a narrative early in the Trump administration, his stressed relationship with the Fed chairman.’

Although Trump would like to wield more power over the Fed, during a November 8 press conference, Powell told reporters he won’t resign if Trump asks, nor does the president-elect have the power to fire him.

Lavish, managing partner at the Bitcoin Opportunity Fund, also pointed to Trump’s double speak as a serious problem, heading into the next four years. “Trump speaks in contradictions,” he told the audience, explaining that while Trump talks tough on tariffs, they may be more rhetorical than actionable.

He also noted that Trump’s ‘drill, baby, drill’ stance aims to reduce US energy costs, which would lower inflation — yet his push for a booming stock market and strong economy could fuel inflation instead.

Trump’s pressure on the Fed to maintain easy monetary policy reflects his desire for market highs, despite criticizing Powell. Cutting federal spending significantly seems unlikely, as trimming entitlements or laying off workers would barely dent the budget. Ultimately, Trump’s policies may favor liquidity, potentially keeping inflation elevated.

Black swans vs. white swans

At the end of the discussion Day, gave each panelist 45 seconds to describe what they believe are the potential economic black and white swan events on the horizon.

Skousen said it could be positive or negative if Trump imitates Argentinian President Javier Milei’s economic policies.

“(Milei) is doing a lot of really good things with really trying to reduce government and reduce the national debt, which is a problem and is headed for a crisis,’ he said.

Trump and Milei share a populist, anti-establishment outlook, but their economic policies reflect different approaches. Trump’s strategy emphasizes protectionism, tariffs and ‘America First’ nationalism, contrasting with Milei’s free-market libertarianism, which includes proposals like dollarizing Argentina’s economy and drastically reducing state involvement.

Building on Skousen’s stance, Johnson stressed the importance of Trump being steadfast.

“I think the potential white swan is that most of the success that is attributed to Milei in Argentina is because he has hit the ground running. He hasn’t slowed down,’ he commented.

‘He’s done exactly what he said he would do, and he keeps charging 100 miles an hour. If Trump does something similar, he has a better chance than is currently expected. But if he slows down, then they’ll eat him alive.’

Bianco underscored that the economy is currently at its full potential, driven by fiscal stimulus.

He then cautioned that if the Fed continues to cut interest rates, it could push long-term yields even higher instead of curbing inflation. This might trigger a sudden bond market collapse, reminiscent of the 2019 repo market spike.

“If the Fed wants to continue to cut rates, they’re just going to continue to drive long-term yields higher and higher and higher, because they’re not fighting inflation,” said Bianco.

“And that could very well turn into a black swan event. A white swan event would be the opposite.”

Lavish also warned of potential trouble in the bond market.

“(If) we have some sort of event like you saw in the fall of 2019, where you saw the repo market spike up, whether that happens because of policy error by the Fed or for some other reason, that’s a black swan event,” he said. “The white swan event would be — I don’t know how this would ever happen — but these guys balance the budget.”

For Grant, the black swan would be inflation rising while the Fed cuts rates due to ‘dysfunction in the government bond market.’ That would ‘crystallize fiscal error and underlying inflation, and the Fed’s too-big balance sheet.”

On the other hand, he joked, Powell buying “his first ounce of gold” would be a white swan event.